My Journey with Liulishuo: Insights from Employee #7 and Former Design Director

On May 4, 2020, it was exactly a year since I left Liulishuo.

For some, Liulishuo is just a job. But for me, it’s a profound journey that changed my life and shaped my character and personality. I joined Liulishuo as the 7th employee in 2013 and worked there for six years, from the early days in a rented apartment to the Nasdaq IPO. I consider this experience something of a legend for an idealist like me, and some stories from it are worth sharing.

Old Wang (Liulishuo CEO Wang Yi) used to say, quoting his mentor, that if a person can do one or two remarkable things in their lifetime, that’s good enough. I feel that Liulishuo counts as one of the remarkable things I’ve done. I often told my colleagues, if your experiences aren’t worth telling as stories down the road, maybe you haven’t struggled hard enough yet. Fortunately, my past experiences left me with some stories.

This time, I’d like to share the story of why I chose to join Liulishuo, my thoughts and actions during the process. On one hand, I simply want to record this story. As I get older, my memory fades, and writing is the best way to preserve memories. On the other hand, I often chat with designer friends about how to choose job opportunities and when to accept startup invitations. I hope this story can inspire friends dealing with these kinds of decisions.

Alright, let’s get to the story.

Beginning

In 2012, I exited a company I co-founded a year and a half earlier. A year and a half before that, I left Alibaba Cloud, giving up a considerable amount of RSU stock options when I was one of its earliest 28 designers. After finishing the startup, on November 14, 2012, at 7:17 PM, I posted on Weibo expressing my interest in exploring new opportunities. This Weibo post got 16 retweets. One of these was seen by Ben, a co-founder of Liulishuo, and he passed it to Wang Yi (CEO of Liulishuo).

Before this, Ben, Wang Yi, and I were complete strangers, not even internet acquaintances. Ben saw the retweet because a user of a browser plugin I made, Weibo Jujian, was among his friends who shared it.

A Heart for Creation - Weibo Jujian

A comparison of a Weibo homepage before and after using “Weibo Jujian.”

Let me explain a bit about the Weibo Jujian product. Around 2011, the user experience on Sina Weibo was terrible. The growing commercialization brought ads that made the already poor experience intolerable for me. Soon, a Chrome plugin tool named Stylish started spreading in the Weibo design/tech circles. Installing Stylish allowed users to modify CSS and customize their Weibo experience. Plus, you could share the CSS with other users.

This was so fun! I tailored a minimalist Weibo experience for myself using it. After a few days, I decided to create my own browser plugin to improve the Weibo experience. Why create a new plugin? I figured that Stylish’s usage threshold and operation cost were too high, merely a toy for pros. I wanted ordinary users to get a pleasant Weibo experience with just a plugin installation. So, I named it “Weibo Jujian”. You can tell how eager I was to simplify the Weibo experience.

Two weeks later, Weibo Jujian was launched. After a few versions, the experience stabilized. At its peak, about 100,000 users used it, and related Weibo topics had 6 million tags. Many industry experts became users, like Feng Dawei, Shao Nan, and Fang Jun. Receiving much user praise, I was most delighted by Shao Nan, now a product director at DXY, who remarked: “This plugin surpassed the Sina UED team.”

Through the Weibo Jujian product, I’d like to share a few points:

• Designers should be sensitive to experiences. Don’t let poor product experiences ruin your taste;
• If given a chance, try to change it;
• Design and create purely for personal interest, even without monetary reward.

These points are both my viewpoint and my trait. It’s this trait that brought the opportunity to join Liulishuo.

Facing the First Invitation

Back to the main story.

An hour after my Weibo post, Wang Yi messaged me on Weibo. Honestly, today is the first time I noticed this “one-hour” timeline detail. Wang Yi’s action and execution, his persistent pursuit of talent, impress me greatly. It’s not just with me, but with Liulishuo’s early and later core employees too.

His message had three keywords: exciting, team established 2 months ago, mobile education. I replied politely but internally thought “haha.” Even though his LinkedIn profile highlighted Google PM experience impressively, I thought the company was too early, only two months in. In 2013, what was mobile education? Also, this founder seemed too impractical, always boasting it was an “exciting” opportunity.

Though Wang Yi kept contacting me, I basically ignored it. During this time, I briefly joined a friend’s startup. At the end of January 2013, a few days before the Spring Festival, I got another message from Wang Yi: the Liulishuo app was about to launch, and he wanted to chat again. So, we arranged to meet at Beta Cafe on Wen Er West Road, owned by Bai Ya (founder of Youzan).

Beta Cafe

That night, Wang Yi showed me the earliest Liulishuo app. It was still unstable, but he confidently expressed his optimism about voice interaction and extended a passionate invitation. My first impression of the app was positive, but my impression of Wang Yi was complex. I felt he was passionate and had ideas but also found him unreliable and boastful. 😄 I left with “I’ll try your app first,” then went back to Xuzhou for the New Year.

Beyond User Experience, Viewing User and Commercial Value of Products

At home in rural Xuzhou during the New Year, with nothing else to do, I tried out the Liulishuo app. In truth, I’m a #continuous learning# English enthusiast (this sounds awkward), consistently reading English articles and the Bible after graduating college. Soon I started to like the Liulishuo app. While its interaction and visual experience were very simple and rough, two core features of the app amazed me, and I vaguely sensed its enormous commercial potential. My business judgment is simple: unique, excellent, and practically applicable user value corresponds to equal commercial value.

Which two core experiences did I appreciate?

Firstly, the red and green scoring of users’ speaking levels. Around 2013, I tried many apps (even planned to try one app weekly), but never saw another product presenting users’ English levels and related speaking issues visually with scores. Never seen online, and even offline teachers rarely had the capability.

The second is the interaction dialogue experience between people and phones. Since I’m into English, in my observations, most people in China don’t get the chance to “speak English” after learning it. They learn it, and it’s like they’re mute. But the human-machine interaction creates a “speak English” scenario. It’s pretty amazing!

App played for a few days, and I couldn’t stand the experience issues anymore. Partly because I was bored, partly because my hands itched. Just like when I couldn’t stand Weibo’s experience, I started redesigning the Liulishuo app according to my preferences.

Designing again out of interest and passion

While the family was making dumplings for the New Year, I completed the redesign of the Liulishuo app, crafting a minimalist experience. Interaction-wise, I reduced the steps from opening the app to completing a speaking exercise as much as possible, letting me (the user) start learning with the shortest path. Visually, it had a more reasonable layout, simplified page elements, and data visualization displays. This design matched my aesthetics and personal usage preferences. (Though it was satisfying for me, a year later, I tasted the bitter fruit of “being too self-centered and ignoring the mass user’s cognitive habits”. I’ll talk about this more later.)

When talking about minimalist design, I have to mention an app that profoundly influenced me: Clear, an app still installed on my iPhone. Key experience concepts of this app: minimalist, flat design, functional use of color, gesture controls. My love for this app is so immense that it’s influenced many of my product designs, including a simplified Weibo.

Clear interface

Talk is cheap, show me the design.

After the Chinese New Year, I proactively reached out to Wang Yi, saying, “I’d like to give some feedback on your app.” He said sure. I chose a little restaurant I often visited on Wen’er Road. He brought the whole team: Ben, Cloud, Jeffary. After chit-chatting and eating, I said, let me show you something. Then, I opened my iPhone album and flipped through the design drafts one by one. (Every time I introduce my work, it’s super exciting for me.)

This restaurant was quite unique, but later it got demolished.

Each time I introduced a UI and explained my design rationale, they responded with WOWs. So much so that Cloud, the first iOS engineer at Liulishuo and a long-term collaborator, said on the spot, “I’m willing to bring this design to life.” It was quite a highlight moment of mutual admiration between industry engineers and designers. Wang Yi later told me about Cloud’s comment; I didn’t actually remember Cloud saying that. 😄

The first design I did for Liulishuo

A few years later, Wang Yi mentioned this incident at a staff meeting, saying that previously, many friends had given him lots of feedback and suggestions, but only Diff did it by “making it happen,” which surprised him.

To be honest, I have a passion and pursuit for design. Naturally, when Liulishuo was later hiring designers, I valued the designers’ passion for their craft. A common question was: Do you create in your spare time? (Do you have a free style?) I appreciate those designers who proactively redesign beloved products.

Don’t rush, make friends first, observe each other

After that exchange, I got to know more about Wang Yi and the team. At that point, I still hadn’t accepted the invitation to join the team. I wanted to observe more. So I said, “Let me do some design for you.” And so, I began a two-month deeper engagement.

This is a classic early promotional photo for Liulishuo, taken by me.

The office was in a duplex residential building at Enji Garden on Wen’er Road in Hangzhou. The first-floor living room was used as an office and space for the engineers to dry their pants, and the second floor was bedrooms.

During those two months, after work weekdays and on Saturdays, I’d go to this office and discuss products and design with the team. Through practical work engagements and close-up observation, I felt this team matched my style: product people, shared product mindsets, the same language system, executability, able to push things forward, all Mac users. I was introduced to some new concepts like managing projects and tasks with Trello, writing documents with Google Docs, using dental floss (thanks to Ben’s influence). During that time, other interesting things included Cloud being happy to shout English test app phrases out loud, Ben doing exercises cornered in the office without care, and team meals at the community cafeteria.

As I write this part about “joining a company or a startup,” here’s some advice I want to share:

• Don’t act impulsively. Generally, company founders are eloquent and can easily sell you on things without you realizing it.
• Do your homework. Task one: Experience the product. Ask yourself, do you like this product?
• Task two: Communicate with key team members. Do you like these people? Do they like you? (Will they help you realize your design ideas? 😄) If possible, work part-time with them for a period, watch closely, and confirm.
• If you like, appreciate, and believe in the product and team, boldly ignore some external conditions like: the product looks ugly, the company’s official website being unbearable, the poor office conditions.
• Design can also be an investment. You’ll need some foresight and judgment.

Taking on risk and uncertainty

After collaborating closely like this, we got to know each other better. Around April 2013, Wang Yi asked me again about joining the team. It felt very natural for both of us. Facing this “invest with design” opportunity, I had some real-life issues to consider: First, Liulishuo would move from Hangzhou to Shanghai in May, but I’d been living in Hangzhou for seven years. I didn’t own a house, but all my social circles and friends were in Hangzhou, and I liked it there. Plus, my daughter was already three, preschool age, so she needed a stable life; Second, Liulishuo’s angel round hadn’t come in yet, so I’d be joining at nearly half-pay. The success of a startup is completely uncertain. These were the risks and uncertainties I had to bear.

Honestly, making this decision wasn’t easy. My wife and I talked a lot about it, and she fully supported me, which was a great encouragement and support. During this time, our family prayed a lot too. Although I didn’t gain a sense of certainty from praying, I just made the decision when it was time, but I felt peaceful and natural when making it. Now, looking back on that decision, I can’t deny it was God’s guidance. Just like when I left Changsha in 2006 to go to Hangzhou, I can’t deny that was God leading me too. Thank God.

Think deeply, then just do it. Discuss the benefits clearly, then get on board.

At the entrance of Enji Garden on Wener Road in Hangzhou

About these considerations and the conditions for joining, Wang Yi and I talked three or four times. Finally, by the pond at the entrance of Enji Garden, we reached a basic consensus on these issues. On April 5, 2013, after some deep thinking, I wrote an email “About joining Liulishuo” to Wang Yi, outlining my thoughts and expectations on the decision, along with a brief statement on the stock options agreement. This email was a way to organize my thoughts; writing things down calms and reassures me. Between Wang Yi and me, this email was a gentleman’s agreement in writing. It wasn’t detailed, just touched on the points, but it was necessary.

Looking back on the email now, I can say with a clear conscience that I’ve met my expectations stated in the email, or rather, fulfilled my promise to Wang Yi. And Wang Yi, or Liulishuo, fulfilled this promise too, giving me ample room to perform and a strong sense of achievement and financial reward. Compared to some companies in the industry, which severely lack contractual spirit and are quite unethical.

After sending the email, I received Wang Yi’s confirmation and response, and just like that, I was aboard. From our initial contact on November 14, 2012, to establishing a cooperative relationship by April 5, 2013—it took about five months. Then, I packed everything, and the three of us moved from Hangzhou to Shanghai.

Hangzhou on the left, Shanghai on the right

In this section, I want to share a few points:

• When choosing a direction or opportunity, besides weighing the benefits, don’t overlook your love and recognition of the matter itself. A bit of idealism is needed (don’t be too realistic);
• When facing tough decisions, try listing all the factors to consider, prioritize them, focus on the big stuff and let go of the small;
• If, after deep thought and discussing with family and trustworthy friends/mentors, then be a bit impulsive in your decision! Overthinking makes you indecisive;
• Your gains are proportional to the uncertainties and risks you bear. If you encounter a good opportunity, you’ll need some risk-taking spirit;
• If there’s talk about shares or options, before joining, make sure to have a relevant agreement or written arrangement: the percentage of options or shares (not just the quantity), how they mature, exit mechanism, etc. The more detailed, the better—don’t worry about so-called face;

For more on options, refer to the key points mentioned in this article: Click here

Three months later, on August 23, 2013, we gained the favor of 1 million users. Indeed, like wealth, the first million is the most exciting and memorable. (Hehe, that last zero is mine.)

In some time, I want to write more stories about my time at Liulishuo: early design recruiting, product design culture, design team management, interesting people at Liulishuo, and so on.

Let’s talk about some recent thoughts. One year has passed so quickly. Originally, I hoped to rest for a year. Later, I found out that resting requires faith and intentional practice. Because, even though the work pressure is temporarily gone and I’m relaxed physically, my mind isn’t relaxed. As a friend said, it’s busy with bits and pieces.

Even though I’ve failed at this resting thing, after struggling, trying, being anxious, and validating my interests/passions/abilities, I’ve recently found some direction. I’ve identified three theme directions combining interest, value, and a sense of achievement:

• Design. Whether in strategy or execution, I enjoy it. Although many people want to switch from design to “upgrade” as a PM or jump circles to do business, over time, through several design projects at hand, I increasingly feel that for me, there’s still a lot of space to do well in design. Moreover, excellent design must have commercial space;
• Helping others grow (not limited to designers). Helping people and giving fellow travelers a light, seeing their growth truly satisfies me. Whether offline or online training courses, sharing, or actually joining a company to lead a design team, they’re all possible forms to consider;
• My personal growth. Recently, I’ve read and listened to many peers, experts, and predecessors’ experiences or shares, feeling a significant gap, and a big space for growth. My growth direction has two areas: design, and leadership;

Besides seeing these three theme directions, I’m trying to think more long-term. The benefit of seeing things long-term is much less anxiety, slowing down a bit, and the sky won’t fall. Looking longer term, it naturally overlooks the so-called age limit of middle-age (I’m 27 in 1983 this year).

Chatting with a designer friend, mentioning “getting older, what will happen”—he turned around and asked me, how old is old? Exactly!

I believe that the insights, accumulation, judgment, and maturity and influence that come with age won’t and shouldn’t disappear cliff-like in the industry or work. Instead, these accumulations will surely be fully exerted and released on the appropriate platform—it must be so. Even though this is still a process of mutual choice, at least for now, I’m confident I’ll encounter such opportunities. Just like encountering Liulishuo 7 years ago.

Finally, here are some ads (previews):

• Planning to do a design series live course, focusing on designer career development, quality improvement, design management, etc. Interested friends can add me on WeChat: diffwang (**Code:**zoom);
• If your company needs design and consulting services (brand design, product user experience consulting, App UX/UI, website design), feel free to add me on WeChat: diffwang (Code:design)
• Also, although I’m currently engaged in independent design consulting work, if I encounter a suitable design management opportunity, I’m also open to communication, which aligns with my three theme directions.